CFD Online Logo CFD Online URL
www.cfd-online.com
[Sponsors]
Home > Forums > CFX

Frozen Rotor Model CFX

Register Blogs Members List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old   July 24, 2011, 22:52
Default Frozen Rotor Model CFX
  #1
New Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6
Rep Power: 6
windsim is on a distinguished road
Hi

I am designing the rotor blades for a coaxial MAV and was trying to run some simulations in CFX.

I have read up on several methods for simulating the flow around the rotor blades and am trying to avoid using a sliding mesh for now as it is quite difficult.

I am instead using the frozen rotor approach and have produced a mesh and have results below.


Boundary Conditions for frozen rotor
Rotor Blade: No Slip Wall
Top and Bottom cylinder: Opening
Periodic Conditions set
Frozen Rotor Interface between disc and outer domain




Pressure Contours with Velocity vectors on Spanwise plane


Pressure Contours on chordwise plane

I have followed the method used in tut12 Axial Rotor/Stator to set up the simulation.


The obvious problem here is that the airfoil doesn't seem to have much of an effect and the rotating domain seems to be making much more contribution. It seems like the results are incorrect for the interface between the rotating and stationary domain. Either I am misunderstanding the frozen rotor model or I have made an error in my model set up.
windsim is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   July 25, 2011, 02:43
Default hi
  #2
Member
 
Rahul Vaibhav
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: India
Posts: 33
Rep Power: 7
rahulv is on a distinguished road
Hi Windsim

I have few questions for you to clearly understand this problem..
1st what are pressure boundary conditions u have applied
2nd please check the rotation axis and direction of frozen rotor
rahulv is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   July 25, 2011, 07:01
Default
  #3
New Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6
Rep Power: 6
windsim is on a distinguished road
Hi rahul,

I have zero relative pressure on both openings and the axis of rotation for the frozen rotor is the global z axis.

Thank you for your time.
windsim is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   July 25, 2011, 07:20
Default hi
  #4
Member
 
Rahul Vaibhav
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: India
Posts: 33
Rep Power: 7
rahulv is on a distinguished road
Hi windsim

I think u are trying to simulate the open to atmosphere condition.
try these boundary conditions .

Inlet: Total pressure 0 Pa
Outlet : static pressure 0 Pa

and please let me know flow rate developed by the rotor blade.


rv
rahulv is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   July 25, 2011, 08:18
Default
  #5
Super Moderator
 
Glenn Horrocks
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 10,646
Rep Power: 84
ghorrocks has a spectacular aura aboutghorrocks has a spectacular aura aboutghorrocks has a spectacular aura about
Your image Velocity vectors on Spanwise plane shows the effect of the domain rotation. Is that what you mean by "the rotating domain seems to be making much more contribution"? If so then just plot the variables "Velocity in Stationary Frame" and they will probably make sense. You need to make sure you understand what frame of reference the velocities are being drawn with respect to.
ghorrocks is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   July 29, 2011, 19:53
Default
  #6
New Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6
Rep Power: 6
windsim is on a distinguished road
Thank you for your responses.

I did plot the velocities in the stationary frame however, it was simply a linear velocity gradient.

The problem with my above model set up is that it does not simulate any relative movement between the rotor blade and the fluid domain. Since the rotor blade is moving with the fluid disc, it appears that there is no relative motion between the disc and the blade. This definitely not the right way to set up the model.

If someone could shed some light on how to simulate the motion of the rotor blade that would be most helpful.
windsim is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   July 30, 2011, 08:04
Default
  #7
Super Moderator
 
Glenn Horrocks
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 10,646
Rep Power: 84
ghorrocks has a spectacular aura aboutghorrocks has a spectacular aura aboutghorrocks has a spectacular aura about
I do not understand most of your last comment. What linear velocity gradient? Relative motion between the rotor blade and what fluid domain?

Regardless, CFX comes with a few rotating domain examples. They are the easiest tutorials to do to see how to set up multiple domain of reference simulations.
ghorrocks is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   November 16, 2011, 18:15
Default
  #8
New Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2
Rep Power: 0
shabaz88 is on a distinguished road
I am also made a similar project using the turbo mode on ansys, then with the one way fsi model i tried to show rotqation of the blade. i possibly can help you but would you be able to send me ur cfx file (geometry, mesh pre)
shabaz88 is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   November 17, 2011, 06:49
Default
  #9
New Member
 
ali abadi
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 5
alix is on a distinguished road
I used the same technique of frozen rotor for wind turbine but I got results about half of the experimental results is that ratio accepted
alix is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   November 22, 2011, 04:50
Default
  #10
RS2
New Member
 
Rachit Singh
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 7
Rep Power: 5
RS2 is on a distinguished road
hi all,

i am trying to simulate the same thing in cfx. but i am stuck at model.

As shown in windsims image, how does one create such model having more than one parts (i.e. the outer domain-biggest, then a wedge inside it and then a blade inside the wedge).

Are all these different parts made while modelling the geometry or they are made seperately and called in during meshing phase. i cannot get this, tho it is elementy question at this stage here, but your comments will helpfull. Thankyou.
RS2 is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   November 23, 2011, 12:14
Default wind turbines
  #11
New Member
 
ali abadi
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 5
alix is on a distinguished road
Hi all,
I am working with Wind turbine simulation and I used the frozen rotor technique with the velocity inlet
b.c. and the outlet and sides of the outer stationary domain I set them as opening and linked the stationary with rotating domains with interface, but i got results less than half of the theoretical torque which i calculated with blade element momentum theory, as in fig. below..
can anyone suggest me some different
b.c.'s or another technique or any other suggestions
with regards
alix

alix is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   November 23, 2011, 23:40
Default
  #12
D.B
Member
 
DB
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 62
Rep Power: 6
D.B is on a distinguished road
Hi,
How many blades are you modelling as against the actual number of blades..if you are modeeling just one blade try multiplying the torque by the number of blades. I know this is a trivial suggestion, but sometimes so are our mistakes..
__________________
-D.B
D.B is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   November 24, 2011, 11:01
Default wind turbines
  #13
New Member
 
ali abadi
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3
Rep Power: 5
alix is on a distinguished road
hi, D.B and all
and thank u for replying
I simulated three blades and calculated directly the torque applied on the rotor, so I don't think this is the problem, but anyway thank you for the suggestion
but what you and other says about the turbulent model SSt or SSG or k-e which one is preferred
and what about the outer domain how big it supposed to be as compared to rotor dia.
with regards
Alix
alix is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   January 5, 2012, 14:25
Default
  #14
New Member
 
soni
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 25
Rep Power: 5
soni_sth is on a distinguished road
Hi everyone,

I went through the thread and seems like this is a place where I can put my question which is pretty similar to the discussion above.

I am simulating a water turbine.I have 3 rotor blades and 9 stator vanes.I am using steady state simulation with frozen rotor.I made the mesh for one rotor and one stator.My BCs are

Pressure at inlet and mass flow outlet

I calculated power developed by turbine by the Z component of teh torque value. But it did not match with the experimental data. Can anyone please suggest me if I am wrong in setting up the model.

1.Do we have to use one rotor and 3 stator blades?
2.Is power calculated from the resultant torque of the Z component of torque?

I would really appreciate your help friends.

Thank you
soni_sth is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
[ICEM] Proper way to name boundaries on 2D model for use in CFX? RossFS ANSYS Meshing & Geometry 4 November 10, 2011 03:38
Pros and Cons for CFX, CFdesign, COMSOL Val Main CFD Forum 3 June 10, 2011 02:20
PhD using CFX Rui CFX 9 May 28, 2007 05:59
CFX 4.4 installation problem Pandu Sattvika CFX 1 December 1, 2001 05:07
Frozen Rotor Interface (CFX 5.5) gilberto CFX 4 November 14, 2001 22:07


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 15:07.