CFD Online Logo CFD Online URL
www.cfd-online.com
[Sponsors]
Home > Forums > General Forums > Main CFD Forum

Why we normally provide velocity at inlet and pressure at outlet for pipe flow?

Register Blogs Community New Posts Updated Threads Search

Like Tree2Likes
  • 1 Post By p07ip705
  • 1 Post By Fabian82

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old   April 30, 2012, 08:18
Default Why we normally provide velocity at inlet and pressure at outlet for pipe flow?
  #1
New Member
 
PARESH GUJARATI
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 4
Rep Power: 14
p07ip705 is on a distinguished road
Hello,
Why we normally provide velocity at inlet and pressure at outlet for pipe flow?
In FLUENT, We need to provide boundary condition like velocity inlet and pressure outlet. When we provide velocity inlet value, where this velocity value will be used to calculate flow field? What is the use of pressure outlet information at outlet condition? which equations will use these values at inlet and outlet?

Sorry for asking simple question but I am having doubt so. Please answer it.
rgd likes this.
p07ip705 is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   April 30, 2012, 11:24
Default
  #2
New Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 8
Rep Power: 14
Fabian82 is on a distinguished road
The choice of variables at inlet/outlet boundary conditions is in fact not unique. However, you have to ensure that information which enters the domain at the boundary is given by a proper choice of variables at the boundary.

For example for the 1D compressible Euler equations, you have 3 characteristic waves in the fluid - a sound wave traveling to the left (at speed u-c), a sound wave traveling to the right (at speed u+c) and an entropy wave (convection at speed u). At the boundaries you have to distinguish four different cases:

- sub-sonic inlet: 2 characteristics enter the domain (u, u+c), 1 characteristic leaves the domain (u-c)
- sub-sonic outlet: 1 characteristic enters the domain (u-c), 2 characteristics leave the domain (u, u+c)
- super-sonic inlet: all 3 characteristics enter the domain (u, u+c, u-c)
- super-sonic outlet: all 3 characteristics leave the domain (u, u+c, u-c), no further boundary information is necessary

For a boundary condition to be well-posed you have to provide the information that fully determines the characteristic waves which _enter_ the domain. This information is needed to solve the fluid field, i.e. to determine the fluxes through the boundary interfaces. The other characteristic waves leaving the domain can be determined from the values within the domain.

For example, for a sub-sonic inlet, the sound and entropy waves entering the domain are fully determined if _one_ of the following pairs of variables are given at the boundary: (density,energy) or (density,velocity) or (pressure, mass flux)
For a sub-sonic outlet, the sound wave entering the domain can be determined by _one_ of the following variables at the outlet: pressure,velocity,mass flux,temperature,enthalpy

The best choice of variables depends on your problem. Good references for further reading are the book by Hirsch "Numerical computation of internal and external flow. Volume 2" or the paper by Jean-Michel Ghidaglia "The normal flux method at the boundary for multidimensional finite volume approximations in CFD" (European Journal of Mechanics - B/Fluids, Vol. 24/1, 2005)
supersoldier likes this.
Fabian82 is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   April 30, 2012, 11:57
Default
  #3
Senior Member
 
Jonas T. Holdeman, Jr.
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Knoxville, Tennessee
Posts: 128
Rep Power: 18
Jonas Holdeman is on a distinguished road
That is a good question. There may be mathematical, computational, and physical reasons. From notions of causality, one might expect that some sort of entrance boundary conditions might be necessary to "prepare" the flow for the region of interest. And this might be necessary for the algorithm one is using.

Incompressible flow is a little strange. For an incompressible fluid in a rigid container, any perturbation of the flow at one point is instantly felt everywhere in the fluid. The state of flow is everywhere consistent. In such a case, inlet and outlet boundary conditions may not be necessary. This is the case if strictly divergence-free finite elements are used in the FEM. There one can use "do nothing" boundary conditions, where inlet and outlet B.C. are not specified.

Considering Poiseulle (so-called pressure-driven) flow in a straight channel for example, one can simulate developed flow with just a few elements along the channel and no in- or out- BCs. One can match the known velocity profile (parabolic in 2D) at the center of the channel as accurately as the cross-channel resolution will allow, while the error at the entrance and exit will be at most a few percent.

The Navier-Stokes equation is a composite equation, being the sum of a pressureless velocity-governing equation and an equation for the pressure as a functional of the velocity. This result follows from the Helmholtz decomposition theorem. In this view, no pressure BC is needed (other than specifying the pressure at one point) because the velocity doesn't depend on the pressure.

Now if one does not use strictly divergence-free functions in a primative variable formulation, then one must use some sort of projection to remove the non-solenoidal component of the approximation. Unfortunately the pressure is often confused with this projected term (they both satisfy the same equation but different BC). The confusion is that when people talk about BC on the "pressure", they are really talking about the projection.
Jonas Holdeman is offline   Reply With Quote

Old   August 3, 2012, 05:53
Default velocity inlet in fluent
  #4
hhh
Senior Member
 
kunar
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 117
Rep Power: 14
hhh is on a distinguished road
Dear friends,
In fluent, For analysis of 2D naca0012 airfoil velocity inlet we give vcostheta in x component & vsintheta in y component, v is inlet velocity.

1)here i start analysis of 3D wing, for that i take naca 0012 airfoil & extrude 100mm, in gambit and analysis in fluent i have doubt how to set velocity inlet, here i consider my velocity is 50m/s, then what is xyz component,please let me know.

2)if you consider 3D wing, (vtantheta for z component) is correct or wrong, please let me know.

2) how to find angle of attack for 3D wing? please let me know
hhh is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply

Tags
pressure outlet, velocity inlet


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pressure Inlet VS velocity Inlet difference Mohsin FLUENT 9 January 4, 2021 10:34
Mass flow inlet and pressure outlet issue nikhil FLUENT 5 December 11, 2013 12:30
Neumann pressure BC and velocity field Antech Main CFD Forum 0 April 25, 2006 02:15
Terrible Mistake In Fluid Dynamics History Abhi Main CFD Forum 12 July 8, 2002 09:11
what the result is negatif pressure at inlet chong chee nan FLUENT 0 December 29, 2001 05:13


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 23:27.