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Old   September 5, 2008, 20:59
Default Hello, I have a doubt about
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Alberto Passalacqua
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Hello,

I have a doubt about rhoCentralFoam. What do instructions like the following do?

surfaceScalarField rho_pos = fvc::interpolate(rho, pos, "reconstruct(rho)");
surfaceScalarField rho_neg = fvc::interpolate(rho, neg, "reconstruct(rho)");

In particular, I don't understand the role of "pos" and "neg".

Thanks in advance for any help.

With kind regards,
Alberto
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Old   September 8, 2008, 11:05
Default Alberto, When interpolating
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E. David Huckaby
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Alberto,

When interpolating (reconstructing) a variable (e.g. "rho") from cells to faces there is a value associated with each side of the face. The "interpolate" function only returns an average of these two values. When using an "upwind"-type interpolation scheme the flux, "pos" or "neg", will weight (or select) the face value to "upwind" side of the face.

For rhoCentralFoam, I think the idea is to select a suitable interpolation scheme such that
"pos" > 0 to extract to the left value and
"neg" < 0 to extract to the right value.

hope this helps
Dave
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Old   September 8, 2008, 12:59
Default Thanks David for your answer.
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Alberto Passalacqua
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Thanks David for your answer. Let me try to see if I understand it right :-)

Let's consider this picture of a simple squared grid:



If I consider the face between i-1 and i, if I take the "pos", I should get the value in i, while if I take the "neg" I obtain the value in i-1.

In the same way, if I consider the face betweem i and i+1, if I take the "pos", I obtain the value in i, and if I take the "neg", the value in i+1.

Does this sound right to you?

Thanks again,
Alberto
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Old   September 8, 2008, 14:01
Default Alberto, I agree with the a
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E. David Huckaby
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Alberto,

I agree with the above statements, if the "face area vectors" point outward from cell i,j.

If all the "face area vectors" are pointed either toward the right or to the top, then:

on face the between i-1 and i (i-1/2),
"pos" would return rho[i-1]
"neg" would return rho[i]
on face the between i and i+1 (i+1/2),
"pos" would return rho[i]
"neg" would return rho[i+1]

The above is for zero-order reconstruction. For "cell-based" higher order reconstruction (e.g. limited-linear), the face values would take the form:
rho_pos[i+1/2] = rho[i] + drho[i]*(x[i+1/2] - x[i])
rho_neg[i+1/2] = rho[i] + drho[i]*(x[i+1/2] - x[i+1])

where drho[i] is limited gradient of rho at cell "i"

Dave
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Old   September 8, 2008, 14:09
Default David, yes, that's what I m
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Alberto Passalacqua
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David,

yes, that's what I meant. I didn't specify the face are vector direction.

Thanks again for your help :-)

Alberto
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Old   September 9, 2008, 04:34
Default Alberto, the trick of pos a
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Luca Gasparini
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Alberto,

the trick of pos and neg is the trick I thought about when I developed the centralFoam code, from which rhoCentralFoam has been later derived by the people at OpenCFD.

In OF, surface fields have just one single value which is related to the face, but when you apply Godunov-like scheme you actually want to compute the flux through a face solving (maybe approxiamtely) the Riemann problem defined by the TWO different states of the fluid on the opposite sides of each face.

Thus, for each unknown (say p, U and T), you need to evaluate two surface fields with the values of the variable on the two sides of the face.

The fvc::interpolate function normally use the sign of the velocity flux to "decide" how to upwind the cell values in order to interpolate a face value. So the idea was to "fool" the interpolation routine calling it twice: once with a "positive" flux (e.g. +1) and one with a "negative" flux (e.g. -1). Depending on the selected interpolation scheme, as explained by David, you will get two (most likely) different estimates of the face values from which the Godunov-like scheme (in this case a central-upwind scheme) can be applied.

The nice (and somewhat unusual) thing in OF is that given an internal face it always has an "owner" and a "neighbour": in OF notation the flux is positive if the flow is going through the face from the owner cell to the neighbour cell, and negative otherwise (i.e. the face normal is positive from owner to neighbour).
Thus, because of the unstructured grid used in OF you cannot easily think interms of i-1,j and i,j but you better think in terms of owner/neighbour relation.

So you actually solve a Riemann problem at each face between an "owner-side" and a "neighbour-side" with the convention that the flux will be positive in the "owner-to-neighbour" direction. It doesn't matter if (in a more conventional way of thinking) face normals are outward or inward with respect to any given cell. At the end, everything will be consistent.

Kind regards,

Luca
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Old   September 9, 2008, 05:18
Default Hi Luca, take a look to the
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Luca M.
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Hi Luca,

take a look to the original paper of Kurganov about Riemann solver free approach implemented in the rhoCentralFoam solver: may be it can help you to better understand the algorithm

http://www.cscamm.umd.edu/centpack/publications/files/KT_semi-discrete.JCP00-cen tpack.pdf

Regards

Luca
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Old   September 9, 2008, 07:49
Default Dear Luca, Thank you for yo
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Luca Gasparini
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Dear Luca,

Thank you for your hint.
I don't want to appear arrogant but I'm the one who wrote the (original) centralFoam code, so I know about Kurganov et al. Riemann free approach.
Still, it is a Godunov-like scheme and it is quite close to an approximate Riemann-solver based solver. In fact you could easily use the most of centralFoam substituting KT scheme with Roe's one; including the trick with pos and neg "fictitious fluxes".

In the previous explanation I used the "Riemann problem" concept because it's the most familiar approach.

If you are interest:
http://www.cfd-online.com/cgi-bin/Op...1867#POST11867

Kind regards,

Luca
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Old   September 9, 2008, 08:36
Default Dear Luca, sorry about it.
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Luca M.
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Dear Luca,

sorry about it. I've typed the wrong name starting the thread :-) The suggestion was for Alberto and the paper could be useful anyway.


Luca
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Old   September 9, 2008, 11:29
Default Thanks all a lot for the compl
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Alberto Passalacqua
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Thanks all a lot for the complete information!

Regards,
Alberto
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Old   January 13, 2010, 21:01
Default X-posted from other thread
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Im trying to solve a free-jet problem by rhoCentralFoam [OF 1.5]. My domain represents a close chamber in which the jet enters at Supersonic conditions.
My code crashes due to a FPE , I am getting -ve pressure & density at the outlet .



this is obviously due to solving the h equation. I do not understand what is causing this error . ill post my BC;s & the thermoPhysicalProperties directory .

Code:
dimensions      [1 -1 -2 0 0 0 0];

internalField   uniform 42000;

boundaryField
{
    wall
    {
        type            slip;
    }
    axis
    {
        type            empty;
    }
    outlet
    {
        type            nonReflective;
        refValue        uniform 6600;
        gamma           1.4;
        phi             phi;
        psi             psi;
        valueFraction   uniform 0.2;
        refGradient     uniform 0.2;
        value           uniform 6600;
    }
    inlet
    {
        type            totalPressure;
        U               U;
        phi             phi;
        rho             none;
        psi             none;
        gamma           1.4;
        p0              uniform 101325;
        value           uniform 101325;
    }
    frontAndBackPlanes
    {
        type            empty;
    }
    front
    {
        type            wedge;
    }
    back
    {
        type            wedge;
    }
}
U
Code:
dimensions      [0 1 -1 0 0 0 0];

internalField   uniform (260.39 0 0);

boundaryField
{
    wall
    {
        type            slip;
    }
    axis
    {
        type            empty;
    }
    outlet
    {
        type            zeroGradient;
    }
    inlet
    {
        type            fixedValue;
        value           uniform (315 0 0);
    }
    frontAndBackPlanes
    {
        type            empty;
    }
    front
    {
        type            wedge;
    }
    back
    {
        type            wedge;
    }
}
Code:
thermoType      hThermo<pureMixture<sutherlandTransport<specieThermo<hConstThermo<perfectGas>>>>>;

mixture         perfectGas 1 28.9 1004.3 200.0 1.458e-6 110.4;

rhoMin          rhoMin     [1 -3 0 0 0]     0.001;
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Old   January 14, 2010, 09:49
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I also has a question about the accuracy of the solver as claimed in the paper :Implementation of semi-discrete, non-staggered central schemes in a colocated, polyhedral, finite volume framework, for high-speed viscous flows by Christopher J. Greenshields1,2,∗,, Henry G. Weller2, Luca Gasparini3 and Jason M. Reese1

In the solution of the Ladenburg Free Jet problem , this article claims accurac in successful reproduction of experimental results by computational method. The following picture shows the matching of the shock locations & profiles.


However the converged results obtained from the tutorial LadenburgPsi60 of rhoCentralFoam show shock profile slightly different from the above image . The picture in the article shows a prominent "Mach Disc" , while the same in the tutorial appears smeared .


Can you explain to me the difference in the two sets of results ? Is the difference due to accuracy or simply a matter of interpretation ?
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Old   January 18, 2010, 11:02
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Could anyone please help me with this ? I can present some more details if necessary

Thank You
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Old   December 18, 2011, 10:05
Default Central Scheme in rhoCentralFoam VS fvSchemes
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Hi all,
I'm not too experienced with CFD so I apologize for stupid questions in the first place ;-).

I'm wondering about a very general thing concerning rhoCentralFoam. It is a central Scheme by construction right?
I looked through "Implementation of semi-discrete, non-staggered central schemes in a colocated, [...] finite volume framework [...]" by Greenshields, Gasparini et. Al. There is the following explanation:
"In the KT [Kurganov / Tadmor] method, the f + and f − contributions are weighted equally so that the weighting coefficient is alpha=0.5, hence its description as a central scheme."
So my question is: Why is it possible, to specify an upwind div scheme or interpolation Scheme for rhoCentral Foam? Respectively, Do I change the idea of rhoCentralFoam by using an upwind scheme together with a Tadmor flux Scheme?

The reason for the question is simply, that I have great difficulties to distinguish between all the different upwind / central Scheme possibilities .

Thanks a lot, regards
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Last edited by schwermetall; December 20, 2011 at 08:25.
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Old   December 21, 2011, 05:26
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No ideas ?
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Old   April 22, 2012, 03:51
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I ran the case forward step from the rhoCentralFoam tutorials, but when I tried to plot the residuals, interestingly I saw that all of the residuals are zero, any idea?
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Old   April 23, 2012, 04:05
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M K Singh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luca View Post
Hi Luca,

take a look to the original paper of Kurganov about Riemann solver free approach implemented in the rhoCentralFoam solver: may be it can help you to better understand the algorithm

http://www.cscamm.umd.edu/centpack/publications/files/KT_semi-discrete.JCP00-cen tpack.pdf

Regards

Luca
The link given in this thread does not work
http://www.cfd-online.com/cgi-bin/Op...1867#POST11867
Is there a new link?
With best regards.
M K
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Old   April 23, 2012, 15:26
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Mahdi Hosseinali
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I did download it a few days ago, that is fine
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Old   April 23, 2012, 17:36
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I mean this thread:
http://www.cfd-online.com/cgi-bin/Op...1867#POST11867
I am able to download the pdf but not able to see the above thread (see #8)
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Old   April 27, 2012, 13:28
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You are right, that is not displaying any more
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