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Chris R. Kleijn September 26, 2000 04:03

ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
First Announcement and Call for Papers


in conjunction with the ASME PVP Division Conference July 22-26, 2001, Hyatt Regency, Atlanta, Georgia, USA

- abstract submission: October 27, 2000

- draft paper submission: January 12, 2001

- final paper submission: April 13, 2001

SCOPE: Modern industrial applications of Computational Fluid Dynamics require the solution of complex fluid-flow problems in conjunction with equipment design, process and product development. For the successful solution of these problems, a high degree of coordination between industrial CFD engineers, software developers, consultants and academic scientists is necessary. This symposium, to be held for the third time, addresses these issues by focussing on computational modeling of industrially relevant fluid flows in interaction with participating media (solid confinements, porous structures, dispersed phases, plasmas, etc.) and physical/chemical phenomena (diffusion transport, thermal stress, flow induced vibrations, electromagnetic transport, heat generation & dissipation, electrophoresis, phase change, combustion, CVD, chemical reactions, etc.). Participation from the industry is especially encouraged.

SYMPOSIUM HISTORY: The Symposium was held for the first time July 1998 in San Diego, California, in conjunction with the 1998 ASME/JSME Pressure Vessels and Piping Division Conference. It immediately became the largest Symposium of the Conference, with 16 Sessions, during which 66 contributed and 6 keynote papers were presented by authors from industry, academia, CFD consultants and software vendors, representing 20 different countries. Papers were published in two separate volumes, ASME- PVP 377-1 and 377-2,which can be ordered from the ASME ( The second Symposium was held August 1999 in Boston, Massachusetts, in conjunction with the 1999 ASME Pressure Vessels and Piping Division Conference. This time, the Symposium had grown to 20 sessions, during which 72 contributed and 6 invited keynote papers were presented by authors from 22 countries. In addition, a panel session on "modern trends in industrial computational fluid dynamics and physics" was organized. Papers were published in ASME volumes PVP- 397-1 and PVP-397-2 which can be ordered from the ASME catalog ( From 2001 on, the Symposium will continue as a bi- annual "International Symposium on Computational Technologies for Fluid/Thermal/Chemical Systems with Industrial Applications".

TOPICS: Specific topics may include (but are not limited to):

- The use of CFD in hardware design, process optimization and product development applications in industry;

- Large-scale numerical studies with industrial applications;

- Advanced turbulence modeling and Large Eddy Simulations for industrial flows;

- Modeling of fluid-solid interactions via conjugate heat transfer, thermal stress or load coupling;

- Integration of complex physics and/or chemistry into CFD;

- Coupled multi-scale (microscopic-macroscopic) modeling and multi-scale model integration;

- CFD code interfacing (code-to-code, grid-to-grid, flow to stress, etc.) and integrated code development;

- Object oriented CFD code architecture and CFD command languages;

- Grid generators and pre-processors;

- Novel solvers, codes and algorithms, numerical accuracy analysis;

- CFD implementation for model based control;

addressing single and multiphase, laminar and turbulent flows, free surface flows, flows with phase transition, molecular flow, plasma flow etc.

Applications may stem from, amongst others:chemical process industry; automotive & aerospace industry; - manufacturing industry; energy conversion & combustion; micro-electronics industry; biological & environmental studies; nuclear industry; pharmaceutical & medical industry, etc.

KEYNOTE LECTURES: During the past two (1998 and 1999) Symposia, invited keynote presentations were given by, amongst others, Prof. Brian Spalding (CHAM), Prof. David Gosman (Star- CD), Dr. George Bache (AEA/CFX), Prof. S. Maruyama (Tohoku University), prof. Y. Matsumoto (The University of Tokyo), Dr. Ellen Meeks (Reaction Design), and Dr. A. Krishnan (CFDRC). They addressed various novel developments in process and structure integrated CFD. For the third Symposium, invitation will be extended to prominent CFD experts from various branches of industry and academia, to present keynote lectures on the application of process and structure integrated CFD in industrial design and optimization problems.

TUTORIALS AND SOFTWARE DEMONSTRATIONS: Tutorials are being planned and CFD software demonstrations will be organized at the Conference. Please contact the corresponding organizers with proposals.

DATES AND LOCATION: The Symposium will be held in conjunction with the ASME Pressure Vessels and Piping Division Conference, July 22-26, 2001, at the Hyatt Regency, Atlanta, Georgia, USA (

(Other "fluid related" Symposiums at the PVP Conference anticipate approximately 110 presentations, on topics such as Flow Induced Vibrations, Fluid-Structure Interactions and Wave and Blast Propagation. Other "non-fluid related" Symposiums at the PVP Conference anticipate approximately 800 papers, covering different aspects of Finte Element Stress Analysis, Fatigue, Crack Propagation, Non- destructive Evaluation, Pressure Vessels Design, ASME Codes, Piping Technologies, etc. Most papers at ASME-PVP Conferences are application-oriented, and many of them are presented by industrial researchers.)

PAPERS AND PUBLICATION: Contributed papers will be accepted based on submitted abstracts and peer-review of full papers. Accepted full papers will be published in ASME Conference Proceedings bound volumes, which will be available at the Conference. In principle, all accepted papers will be invited for oral presentation at the Symposium. Authors of accepted papers are expected to participate in the Symposium and to personally present their paper. Submission of student papers is strongly encouraged.


- Submit abstracts, using Fax, e-mail or (courier) Mail, by October 27, 2000, to the appropriate Symposium Organizer;

- Authors of accepted papers will be notified by November 13, 2000;

- Drafts of full papers are due January 12, 2001, for review;

- Authors will be notified of reviewers comments and final paper acceptance by March 5, 2001;

- Final papers are due April 13, 2001.

REGISTRATION: To register your name with the Symposium distribution list, please forward your name and e-mail address to For further information about the Symposium, please contact one of the organizers, or visit our Web-site: .



Dr. Vladimir Kudriavtsev

CFD Canada

50 Graydon Hall Drive, ste 401

Toronto, ON M3A 3A3


Phone : +1-416-441-0803

Fax : +1-416-441-0803



Dr. Satoyuki Kawano

Department of Aeronautics and Space Engineering

Tohoku University

Aoba Aramaki 01, Aoba-ku,

Sendai 980-8577, JAPAN

phone : +81-22-217-6980

fax : +81-22-217-6979



Dr. Chris R. Kleijn

Delft University of Technology

Kramers Laboratorium voor Fysische Technologie

Prins Bernhardlaan 6


phone : +31-15-278-2835

fax : +31-15-278-2838


* SYMPOSIUM WEB-SITE (to be accessible soon): [USA + worldwide] [Japan]

John C. Chien September 26, 2000 20:12

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
(1). If ASME announces every cfd or fluid-thermal related meetings here, I think, that's the end of the world. (2). The persons who are interested in and are capable of attending the meeting, normally, would have done the journal search and plan ahead of the time in their calendar. (3). So, the announcement here can gain only extra negative reactions. Please respect the feeling of the ordinary readers of the forum. (ASME members automatically receive the mechanical engineers journal which has all the meeting schedules listed already.)

Bart Prast September 27, 2000 05:09

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
I'm not a ASME member yet, so I'm still dependend on the posts in this group. I would really appreciate announcements of CFD conferences (with industrial applications) in this group.

John C. Chien September 27, 2000 09:31

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
(1). You simply don't come to the cfd forum section to read the "First Announcement and Call For Paper"... You go to the Resources section and look for it. (2). The same is true, I am sure that you don't go to the publication section to look for the meeting announcement information at ASME site. right? (3). The more efficient way to do is to type in "cfd conferences" at a search site. You should get back at least a thousand items related to the cfd conferences world wide.

Chris R. Kleijn September 27, 2000 11:47

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
We are organizing this Symposium for the third time. We, that is just three devoted CFD practicioners, two of which are not even ASME members. Conferences like this are organized by people like you, not by big bad organizations. It's not ASME that put the announcement in the forum, it's us. We need ASME as a vehicle to get things going, but we are not ASME.

History proves that John C. Chien is wrong. Some 50% of our participants is not an ASME member. Some 25% of our participants heard about the Symposium through our previous years announcements in this forum.

In the official ASME publications, you will find not much more than the title of the Symposium, as it is indeed one of the very many that ASME is supporting. Did John C. Chien really attempt to find information about this Symposium through the ASME link in the Resources section? It's not there! Therefore, we feel that the information in our Call for Papers might indeed be useful to the CFD community.

By organizing this Symposium, and by announcing it in this forum, we hope to do (part) of the CFD community a favor, and to help promoting good CFD practice. Thus, our aims are the same as John C. Chien's.

John C. Chien September 27, 2000 13:28

That's not the issue,
(1). If you think the symposium is really very important, then why not do it here in the forum? Because that's not the issue. (2). The issue is , in the middle of the discussions, we have this announcement posted, a long one. And it tends to disturb the setting. That's all. (3). I have noticed this symposium a couple of years ago. But because of the way it is announced, I have decided not to pay attention to it. (4). And if many came from this forum, why not organize an online symposium in this forum. So, the readers of this forum can present the papers, discuss the technical issues right here. (5). It is quite misleading to use ASME to attract the forum readers. And I am sorry thatI thought it was part of ASME activities. (6). I thought you understand that one should not disturb the meeting when people are having discussions. (7). Without the basic understanding of the respect, the value of the symposium has no meaning whatsoever. Let me re-iterate it, we are concerned about the way it is posted here in the main forum (vs resources section, or as a sponsor of the forum), we have not touched the value or contents of the symposium yet. So, it is the art of presenting the material which is in question.

keith September 27, 2000 13:56

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001

As a frequent reader -- but infrequent poster -- on this forum, I thought I'd weigh in on this. I appreciate you posting the announcement for the CFD symposium. The idea that it is some kind of "interruption" is, quite frankly, ridiculous. It is very pertinent to the readers of this newsgroup, much more so than some of the "philosophical musings" that I often find here. Some might object that the forum should be reserved for technical discussion, but these same folks spend a lot of time using it as an op-ed page. And that's okay. I think that this group should be used for any and all CFD-related discussion, Jonas can correct me if I'm wrong.

Although the majority of posts on this group might come from Dr. Chien, please be aware that he doesn't speak for all of the participants. Thanks for keeping us informed.

Regards, Keith

John C. Chien September 27, 2000 14:50

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
(1). " please be aware that he doesn't speak for all of the participants." ? (2). Who is he? And Who are the participants? (3). The only issue here is: the message itself and the place to put it. (4). When you read, you are reading only the messages posted. (it does not represent the person at all) The discussion is about where to put the announcement message. And we don't worry about the contents of the message. It is the responsibility of the reader to decide what to read and what to use after reading the messages.(5). And if you are still reading, then apparently you like it. (I mean, you like the message itself.) All of this does not just happen by accident. So, you are encouraged to present your questions and ideas related to CFD here. (6). The idea of including everything related to CFD is not new. But since the world is so diversified, we had already eliminated the political side of the discussions, which is essential to the well being of the readers. ( Wasn't Dr Wen Ho Lee just released from the jail? Was that also part of the discussions earlier this year in this forum? And he was also an expert in weapon cfd at Los Alamos Lab.)(7). Your observation is fairly accurate, we are trying to keep the forum alive. With millions of website world wide, how many are dedicated to cfd? Is it my responsibility? No. Is it your contribution? Yes.

Ed Blosch September 27, 2000 17:59

Who died and made you king?
It's a public forum and there is no moderator as far as I know. You don't get to say who can post what. Anyone can post anything they want....for example, watch me as I post a list of funny phrases you can say to eccentric CFD people: (here I go!)

"The fact that no one understands you doesn't mean you're an artist."

"I don't know what your problem is, but I'll bet it's hard to pronounce."

"Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental."

"I like you. You remind me of when I was young and stupid."

"What am I? Flypaper for freaks!?"

"You sound reasonable . . . time to up my medication."

"I'll always cherish the initial misconceptions I had about you." (good for any hire gone bad)

There, now wasn't that fun?

John C. Chien September 27, 2000 19:57

Re: Who died and made you king?
(1). well, based on the phrases presented, you are qualified for the ambassador to China position. I mean my feeling is they are very practical , yet, they love to present ideas in abstract forms. (2). The mistake President Reagan made was that both the American aerospace industries and the Soviet Union were destroyed. (3). Ed, we don't want to destroy the enemy. We need the enemy, so we can stay alive. (4). In Dr. Wen Ho Lee's case, it simply says the majority opinion (such as the newspaper empire, etc...) is trying hard to become the minority story. (4). So, let it be, perhaps is the ultimate approach to the system problem. (5)."Anyone can post anything they want...." is the ultimate American goal. It took one hundred year for American women to vote? And it is going to take a while for you to forget about your messages just posted. That's the side effect. Human has not learned how to forget. And the wars and conversations are repeated over and over again. (6). I think, men simply do not understand what they are. So, I think, CFD is one sure way to cure the defect.

A.Hassaneen September 28, 2000 04:20

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
I'm afraid we are turning the forum to a personal conflect which is not the idea. Simpley, why don't you, Jonas, try to open a separate section (paid one) for all those people who want to advertise (in case they make profit from their activity). Then we could keep this main forum for technical issues of interest to the CFD community. The other thing is Jonas also may allow Free announcement on that section for FREE (courses, Journals, Software e.t.c). What do you think??

A.Hassaneen September 28, 2000 04:32

Re: Who died and made you king?
John, I think it's a good idea to stop reacting to what's writen above and to focus on real CFD problem as you always do. The only thing is try to be little clear in you answers and try to avoid using (hidden) words.

Jonas Larsson September 28, 2000 15:03

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
You asked for my opinion so I'll give it. However, let me emphasize that I don't want to tell anyone what to post or not. I'm sure that you guys can sort that out better yourself without me acting as a police.

To be honest I don't think that the few conference announcements we've seen here are a big problem. Personally I find it useful when people announce new CFD conferences here, at least as long as the events are CFD-related and of interest to a worldwide audience. There hasn't been many conference announcements posted here so I don't really see the problem yet. If or when the number of announcements becomes irritating I will open separate announcement service. However, before we see a clear need for such a service I don't want to open it. Opening new services without a real need for them is no use - it is just extra work and they will be a dissapointment for everyone who tries to use them. The web is full of examples of good ideas that fail due to lack of a large enough user-base. I suggest that we welcome conference-announcemets here and let this forum slowly mature a userbase and then start the new service when we see the need for it - as we did with the separate code-specific discussion forums.

The announcement that triggered this debate was clearly marked with an appropriate subject-line so those not interested in conferences could easily avoid reading it. However, if I'm not misstaken there has been 4 announcements posted here for this conference, this is pushing the limit a bit in my opinion. One announcement is enough. I guess this is why some people reacted now.

CFD September 28, 2000 16:13

Re: Who died and made you king?
Curious .. all this stuff about Wen Ho Lee .. is it more related to CFD than the symposium?! And RONALD REAGAN!

John C. Chien September 28, 2000 17:15

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
(1). It is impossible to change a person, and (2). It is useless to force a system to change. (3). I think, the first intuition is always right. In this case, it is just some feeling from the readers, the webmaster, etc. (4). The rule is, people formed companies, hire engineers to create software (products), sponsor the cfd-online, answer questions in the forum to help the users. All of these require resources and dedication. (5). So, if the announcement of services, short cources, websites, and symposium can generate more resources for the forum, then the extra service is justified. I think, the real feeling is related to this issue. That is, any announcement which involves money in the process should follow the same rule of the sponsors. It is hard to ask the sponsors not to get active in promoting their product, while letting others to announce the services, and promote products in the main forum. (5).I would suggest that: in the main forum, the questions are free (because the readers support the forum), the answers are free (because the so-called experts support the forum), so the services or products announced must also be free if announced in the main forum. If the services or products announced in main forum are not free, then we will have difficulties in keeping the forum alive, because we are using double standards. (6). So, if you are selling services or products, then go for the sponsorship and keep the forum alive that way. Actually, we should charge a higher rate for those who use the cfd-online only occasionly. (7). So, in main forum, anything must be free. Jonas, do you see my point? (American women voter issue-double standard issue, Dr Wen Ho Lee issue-double standard issue, announcement in main forum of non-free services and products issue-double standard issue.) It is perfectly all right to announce a free service and free product in the main forum, Jonas can you accept this? Any service must be fair and with respect. (8). When to implement it? the system will make its decision at the right time as usual. If you fail to see that, then you will become a police. If you apply a single standard, you are hand free. (I don't care, because my answers to the questions are always free.)

Jonas Larsson September 30, 2000 12:14

Re: ASME CFD Symposium, Atlanta, 22-26 July 2001
I see your point John and I agree with you - commercial advertising can be a danger to this forum and companies should avoid posting pure commercial ads here - most companies also do avoid this. I don't want to ban everything commercial from the forum though. The line between what is useful for many readers and what is just irritating advertising is very difficult to draw. My personal opinion is that conference annoucements are okay, even if the conferences cost money to attend.

John C. Chien October 2, 2000 09:15

Thanks for the answer, that's fine with me
(1). That's fine with me, as long as you put it in writing somewhere in the guidelines, so readers can follow the same rule.

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