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temporary historian October 23, 2002 21:06

one-year without John C. Chien
At first I was afraid to post this message, but I have done so anyway, perhaps to some people's great disapproval. In any case I'll keep it very short. I hadn't been on the site in a while and I wanted to see if there were any new validation-related messages. I went searching through the archives and happened to notice the name John C. Chien. More importantly, I noticed that he has not posted since October of 2001 and that there has been no mention of him since November of the same year. So here's to one year without the existential postings of Mr. John C. Chien (for better or worse... though I must admit I personally did enjoy his cryptic ramblings) I hope the old codger is doing well with his new audience... wherever it may be.

J.K. October 24, 2002 05:36

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
I agree. I thought the whole point of websites like this was for people to air their views on CFD....and related topics....more power to John, wherever he is.

cfd-online histotrian October 25, 2002 00:48

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
A group of people ousted John from this forum. They even did not hesitate to attack John personally. I analyse that this group comprised people from stupid commercial packages who offer solutions on everything-cfd beneath the sun. They were not happy when John was posting messages like '99% cfd results are trash'. What they did is that people who are only "mouse-happy cfd modelers" should visit and post stupid messages on cfd without knowing what cfd is. If anyone carefully goes thru the archive, he will notice that with John's departure from the forum, many contributors who were educating us on cfd issues (I mean cfd and not the kind of trash in the name of cfd)have also gradually withdrawn. As a result we have been missing not only John but many others too.

Karl October 25, 2002 02:43

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
I don't think anyone should be ousted and that everyone should be entitled to an opinion. John was mailing interesting material indeed. On the other hand he was also sometime a bit "over the top" or paternalistic in his answers and opinions which is probably why he alienated so many persons. I did not read that a particular breed of persons threw him out however. I do not think either that anybody is vital to the quality of exchanges this site can offer.

Regarding your e-mail, you seem to adopt a similar sectarian attitude you denounce when saying that people who are currently visiting are ""mouse-happy cfd modelers" [who] visit and post stupid messages on cfd without knowing what cfd is". If you advocate something and fight against another why adopt the latter as your way to stress the point?

mystic_cfd October 25, 2002 06:52

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
to contribute, or not to contribute, that is the option of the contributor...

jonas never banned john from this website, he chose to leave - to say he was chased away is putting it a bit aggressively. maybe he didn't leave and is still enjoying the rantings and pantings - only in silent mode.

and perhaps other contributors haven't withdrawn either, they are scanning the posts, looking for the rare gem where the subject line actually corresponds to the contents. we might start a new discussion on whether it is worthwhile to add another forumn for beginners (or maybe for experts)?

may convergence be with you

joel October 25, 2002 07:00

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
sorry, im a little lost here, having only being involved in CFD for 2 and a bit years (1 year undergrad 1 year PhD). Can you tell me who John Chien is as he sounds like a colourfull character who although flamboyant sounds like he is missed. Surely the whole idea of this discussion forum is that anyone and everyone is allowed to express they're opinion, so why boot him? Indeed my supervisor who is sitting over my shoulder reading this is saying how good he was and that she no longer reads CFD-Online in his abence. I would like to hear his views and see what he has to say, can we not get him back? In my thirst for CFD knowledge i want to hear all opinions not just the ones that "mouse happy cfd-modellers" and "stupid people from comercial codes" put forward.

Martin Nilsson October 25, 2002 10:38

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
As a reader of CFD-Online since about three years I feel I must say something. John C. Chien went way over the top last year.

He did always include some philosophy and personal views on some matters in his answers. Some liked it, others did not, which was fine because they could simply ignore him. This could be hard, however, because he was involved in almost every thread, and sometimes they turned the discussion from the original topic to something on a philosophical or moral level. Irritating for the original poster, but every now and then quite interesting. Anyhow, he was always very sensitive about China related topics and the beginning of the end came when he heavily insulted a Chinese, for no other apparent reason than that he was from China. After that the "row" regarding JC's be or not to be on this site began and as I remember it most people then demanded him to be gone.

This is an apolitical forum and should be treated as such. John did not respect this and people got tired of it and asked him to leave. This was especially so a while after the "China-incident" when he had become highly abusive and insulted almost everyone, high and low.

At first he was quietly asked to leave, but then came back with personal threats and spams. Personally I miss his expertise but could not stand the sight of his single-minded complacent ignorant bullying. After some of the things he said and did last year I would not read his posts regardless of what he might have to say. My respect for the man is way gone. It will not come back.


Anthony Wachs October 25, 2002 11:01

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
I share Martin's opinion.

I would like to add that we spent too much time last year speaking about philosophical topics that had nothing to do with CFD, when JC was contributing on the forum. I don't care that JC left the forum. I almost did not read his posts at the end since there were absolutely out of the topic.

I even prefer "stupid posts from mouse-happy CFD modelers" (also I should admit that they used to bother me a bit ...) than JC's gibberish about love, hate, politic, ...

This is a CFD-oriented forum, and I hope it will keeps so. Thus, please do not start again with such discussions ...

Thanks to everybody in advance


Wen Long October 26, 2002 23:24

Re: one-year without John C. Chien

Personally, I think John C. Chien has very vivid characteristics, he's the kind of people who is always energetic and will voice whatever comes to his mind.

Though he put his ideas in a wrong place (we need cfd-talking, and he did philosophically), I guess his willings are good.

I kind of miss him, and hope he is having a better life and enjoying computer graphics(he mentioned once).


cfd-online histotrian October 28, 2002 00:07

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
"Can you tell me who John Chien is" -

this was a subject of speculation as who he is. from a careful collation of his postings the following had emerged :

he took his doctoral degree working on cfd in early seventies after his ms in mech/aero engg. he was a member of a cfd faculty in some north american univ. he had worked for nasa projects from the univ. he had some very good original publications although they never appeared in the name of jcc - was jcc his original name? he had written some text book(s) even. some top brass cfd guys then contributing in this forum knew him well it appeared. apparently he left the univ job and started some kind of consultancy work in cfd. it was quite apparent that he had migrated to us from some other country and definitely not from china. he had joined the forum at the very beginning and while leaving he conveyed that his objective was to keep the forum live as it was at the growing stage.

Lars Ola Liavåg October 28, 2002 03:30

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
Just like last time when this issue was a hot topic, we're not very likely to see everybody in the forum agree. However, for newcomers who don't know what this is all about, I'd suggest them to make a quick search in the archive and read John's postings. Afterwards, they could rethink and make up their mind whether or not they really want to contribute to reviving this rather painful discussion once again.

Lars Ola

Dave October 28, 2002 06:01

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
It is a shame to see that things can get so heated over one person (previous postings). Are we not big enough to ignor comments that are made by people. People leaving the site because JC left ?? what ?? please tell me its not true, are we down to school play ground conduct now. Its always easier to walk away !

If you don't like what some one writes, then ignor it !! 99% of the time the individual shows themselves up when they make the comment, don't lower yourself to the same level.

I for one liked JC's ramblings. And if is is reading this, I'd like to see his return. If you didn't then just don't read his posts.

Surely the beauty of the site is that we have a great diversity of levels of knowledge and experience. One person can never be an expert in all fields. Should our aim not be one of education and not elitism ?

Bill November 4, 2002 05:13

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
which is more important? Getting the answer right to 1.0E-6 or getting a workable solution to a problem in a workable time?

Dan Hinch November 4, 2002 12:23

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
While I did not always agree with John, and found his postings somewhat difficult to read, I'm really disappointed if he was indeed forced to leave the forum.

If individuals did not care for John's viewpoints, they were always free to just skip reading his postings.

Bob November 4, 2002 13:57

Re: one-year without John C. Chien
Unfortunately that was sometime VERY difficult as some conversations got completely overshadowed by John's ease to write long-winded notes taking the discussants away from the original topic and introducing confusion in the exchanges that were existing beforehand.

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