[aerosayan]

In NS solvers, we need turbulence models like RANS, URANS, k-omega, k-sst etc.
But, I have not seen any turbulence models being used in compressible Euler solvers.


As shown in the picture, Euler solvers can directly compute extremely complicated turbulent flows, but it doesn't need any turbulence model.



Why is it like that?
Also, is it a good thing or a bad thing that it doesn't need any turbulence model?
Where would this be useful or harmful?


Thanks and regards
~sayan

[FMDenaro]

Originally Posted by aerosayan

In NS solvers, we need turbulence models like RANS, URANS, k-omega, k-sst etc.
But, I have not seen any turbulence models being used in compressible Euler solvers.


As shown in the picture, Euler solvers can directly compute extremely complicated turbulent flows, but it doesn't need any turbulence model.



Why is it like that?
Also, is it a good thing or a bad thing that it doesn't need any turbulence model?
Where would this be useful or harmful?


Thanks and regards
~sayan

Using Euler equation for compressible flows is typical in shock waves problems. In such a case, the main interest is not in turbulence but in capturing shock waves. This is done generally by using specific schemes that mimics the presence of dissipation by additional terms, as same as happens in turbulence model.



Using NSE you can solve turbulence without any turbulence model, provided that you are able to solve in a DNS manner

[aerosayan]

Originally Posted by FMDenaro

Using Euler equation for compressible flows is typical in shock waves problems. In such a case, the main interest is not in turbulence but in capturing shock waves. This is done generally by using specific schemes that mimics the presence of dissipation by additional terms, as same as happens in turbulence model.



Using NSE you can solve turbulence without any turbulence model, provided that you are able to solve in a DNS manner

Which schemes could we use to accurately mimic the presence of dissipation?


The paper from which I took the image, shows that MWENO-P was better in capturing the instability and turbulence than WENO-P and WENO-JS.


Are these the methods you were mentioning?



Thanks

[FMDenaro]

Yes, you should refer to the ILES literature

[aerosayan]

Originally Posted by FMDenaro

Yes, you should refer to the ILES literature

Could you please name some of these schemes we can use to solve turbulence in compressible Euler solvers?


I tried to find some in literature, but I don't even know what are these dissipative schemes called.


Thanks

[FMDenaro]

Originally Posted by aerosayan

Could you please name some of these schemes we can use to solve turbulence in compressible Euler solvers?


I tried to find some in literature, but I don't even know what are these dissipative schemes called.


Thanks

Have a check at the CTR publications

https://ctr.stanford.edu/


you will see many type of applications for shock-waves flows.


Generally, WENO/TENO, schemes based on monotonicity-preserving flux reconstruction, are in a form suitable for ILES formulation.
Have also a look to the home page of Len Margolin and that of Nikolaus Adams.

[aerosayan]

Originally Posted by FMDenaro

Have a check at the CTR publications

https://ctr.stanford.edu/


you will see many type of applications for shock-waves flows.


Generally, WENO/TENO, schemes based on monotonicity-preserving flux reconstruction, are in a form suitable for ILES formulation.
Have also a look to the home page of Len Margolin and that of Nikolaus Adams.

Ok, thanks professor! That helps a lot.