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Slurry (sand water) flow in twoPhaseEulerFlow possible?

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Old   December 1, 2016, 16:58
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Originally Posted by ebtedaei View Post
Thanks for your reply, I will to use twophaseEulerFoam solver with two phases [air + slurry] but the slurry contains water and fine particles (<70 micron)...!
Now,
1- how do I import the particles here so the solver can solve it?
2- Which solver can you suggest for this case?

Thanks,
Ali
So, you have basically three phases. For my limited knowledge you have different options:
- the three phases modeled Eulerian using multiphaseEulerFoam
- air and slurry with two phasEulerFoam foam, slurry modeled as mixture model (you'll need to tweak the Solver taking inspiration from driftfluxFoam)
- air and water Eulerian, plus particles lagrangian (you'll need to tweak the code to embed lagrangian modeling maybe taking inspiration from sprayFoam or DPMFoam).

I think the easiest way would be using the first option since the solver is already there but I'll leave the last word to people more expert than me.
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Old   December 1, 2016, 18:08
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Hi,

I am looking at the same problem. Air+water and particles in a vessel.

I have checked all the available solvers in openFoam and options could be as below:

multiphaseEulerFoam: treats phases as incompressible phases and you can not have the maximum packing limit for the solid phase unless you modify the code.

reactingMultiphaseEulerFoam: treats phases with thermo dictionary and compressible or mixture is possible. Again there is no packing limiter implemented unless you add it to the solver.

The problem with both of these solvers is the solid phase viscosity will be treated as constant and you can not modify it regarding the volume fraction of it. Also there is no granular pressure model available for it.


I am trying to add the kineticTheoryModel to the solver to see if it is possible to add these functionalities to the solver.

Does any one know the kinetic theory reference which was used in openFoam 1606?

Thanks,
Mohsen
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Old   December 2, 2016, 08:36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mohsen_ba65 View Post
Hi,

I am looking at the same problem. Air+water and particles in a vessel.

I have checked all the available solvers in openFoam and options could be as below:

multiphaseEulerFoam: treats phases as incompressible phases and you can not have the maximum packing limit for the solid phase unless you modify the code.

reactingMultiphaseEulerFoam: treats phases with thermo dictionary and compressible or mixture is possible. Again there is no packing limiter implemented unless you add it to the solver.

The problem with both of these solvers is the solid phase viscosity will be treated as constant and you can not modify it regarding the volume fraction of it. Also there is no granular pressure model available for it.


I am trying to add the kineticTheoryModel to the solver to see if it is possible to add these functionalities to the solver.

Does any one know the kinetic theory reference which was used in openFoam 1606?

Thanks,
Mohsen
This is the sources folder for the kinetic theory implementation for the two-phase solvers (twoPhaseEulerFoam and reacting twoPhaseEulerFoam).

The reference of the kinetic theory for those solvers (at least on OF 3.x and above) is:
- Derivation, Implementation and Validation of Computer Simulation Models for Gas-Solid fluidized beds (Wachem).

I would also suggest the book:
- Multiphase flow and fluidization: continuum and kinetic theory descriptions (Gidaspow)
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Old   December 3, 2016, 13:58
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Originally Posted by tidusuper91 View Post
So, you have basically three phases. For my limited knowledge you have different options:
- the three phases modeled Eulerian using multiphaseEulerFoam
- air and slurry with two phasEulerFoam foam, slurry modeled as mixture model (you'll need to tweak the Solver taking inspiration from driftfluxFoam)
- air and water Eulerian, plus particles lagrangian (you'll need to tweak the code to embed lagrangian modeling maybe taking inspiration from sprayFoam or DPMFoam).

I think the easiest way would be using the first option since the solver is already there but I'll leave the last word to people more expert than me.
Hi Ruben, Thank you very much for your specialist's idea... I enjoyed it!
I checked all the items:
1- For items no.1 and no.2, the solvers of twophaseEulerFoam and multiphaseEulerFoam are suitable for compressible fluid phases based on user guide of OpenFOAM version 4)!
- multiphaseEulerFoam Solver for a system of many compressible fluid phases including heat-transfer.
- twoPhaseEulerFoam Solver for a system of 2 compressible fluid phases with one phase dispersed, e.g. gas bubbles in a liquid including heat-transfer.

But my flow is incompressible, can I use them?

2- For item no.3, I talked with other experts and they recommended interDPMFoam (two phases Eulerian and one phase lagrangian) solver is suitable. Do you agree?

Thanks a lot,
Ali
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Old   December 3, 2016, 14:15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ebtedaei View Post
Hi Ruben, Thank you very much for your specialist's idea... I enjoyed it!
I checked all the items:
1- For items no.1 and no.2, the solvers of twophaseEulerFoam and multiphaseEulerFoam are suitable for compressible fluid phases based on user guide of OpenFOAM version 4)!
- multiphaseEulerFoam Solver for a system of many compressible fluid phases including heat-transfer.
- twoPhaseEulerFoam Solver for a system of 2 compressible fluid phases with one phase dispersed, e.g. gas bubbles in a liquid including heat-transfer.

But my flow is incompressible, can I use them?

2- For item no.3, I talked with other experts and they recommended interDPMFoam (two phases Eulerian and one phase lagrangian) solver is suitable. Do you agree?

Thanks a lot,
Ali
Another thing that changes there is not only compressibility/incompressibility but also the way the different phases are modeled (mixture, eulerian or lagrangian). Try to investigate what this means (the Rusche thesis is a good starting point) and what matters most to you.

By the way you can use twoPhaseEulerFoam also for incompressible flow (you can force it to make 0 iterations for the energy equation) or, maybe better, reactingTwoPhaseEulerFoam with an Isothermal Phase Model.

I'm for sure no expert here. .

For what concerns interDPMFoam I have absolutely no experience, from inspection I would guess it's a merge of interFoam (VOF method) + DPM Foam (Lagrangian).

For what you say it seems that how you should model the phases is not perfectly clear. Try to investigate on Eulerian vs Lagrangian, Mixture model and also VOF.

Good luck!
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Old   December 3, 2016, 16:10
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Originally Posted by tidusuper91 View Post
Another thing that changes there is not only compressibility/incompressibility but also the way the different phases are modeled (mixture, eulerian or lagrangian). Try to investigate what this means (the Rusche thesis is a good starting point) and what matters most to you.

By the way you can use twoPhaseEulerFoam also for incompressible flow (you can force it to make 0 iterations for the energy equation) or, maybe better, reactingTwoPhaseEulerFoam with an Isothermal Phase Model.

I'm for sure no expert here. .

For what concerns interDPMFoam I have absolutely no experience, from inspection I would guess it's a merge of interFoam (VOF method) + DPM Foam (Lagrangian).

For what you say it seems that how you should model the phases is not perfectly clear. Try to investigate on Eulerian vs Lagrangian, Mixture model and also VOF.

Good luck!
Ok,
Can you send me Rusche thesis?
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Old   December 3, 2016, 18:02
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Originally Posted by ebtedaei View Post
Ok,
Can you send me Rusche thesis?
Please don't get mad with me. Just a bit of humor.

https://goo.gl/LHPDuc
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Old   December 5, 2016, 04:24
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Originally Posted by ebtedaei View Post
Ok,
Can you send me Rusche thesis?
Hi Ruben,

I found a new animation of Cyclone simulation using OpenFOAM as called "CFD Support Preprocessing Training Tutorial Cyclone Euler-Euler".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtxNXs1aHK8

Please see it I have several questions about it and thank you help me to do this simulation!

Best,
Ali
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Old   December 5, 2016, 05:09
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Originally Posted by ebtedaei View Post
Hi Ruben,

I found a new animation of Cyclone simulation using OpenFOAM as called "CFD Support Preprocessing Training Tutorial Cyclone Euler-Euler".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtxNXs1aHK8

Please see it I have several questions about it and thank you help me to do this simulation!

Best,
Ali
1- Why is this movie called Euler-Euler But in explaining the conditions and simulation parameters a continuous phase and a discrete phase has been named !?

2- We have air core in cyclone, why air phase has not been considered !?

3- There isn't mixture model in twoPhaseEulerFoam solver but we need mixture model in cyclone !!!

Please help me.
Ali
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Old   December 11, 2016, 01:03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ebtedaei View Post
1- Why is this movie called Euler-Euler But in explaining the conditions and simulation parameters a continuous phase and a discrete phase has been named !?

2- We have air core in cyclone, why air phase has not been considered !?

3- There isn't mixture model in twoPhaseEulerFoam solver but we need mixture model in cyclone !!!

Please help me.
Ali
1- As I said before, I would suggest you to take some time to read the differences among the several methods available for multiphase modeling. With Eulerian modeling you can also model discrete phases as an Eulerian field (in facts there is also kinetic theory for that implemented in it). It depends from what you want to achieve.

2 - That's a modeling choice. They probably decided that air is not important for them. BTW you can account for a third phase using multiphaseEulerFoam

3- why you need mixture model? In general Euler - Euler is a more detailed way to model multiphase flow than mixture model. Again, it depends from what you're looking for...

I again suggest you to investigate more on the available modules and then choose what you need (as always there is not a unique answer to this).

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