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How to simulate the flow of the particles (like sand) inside a pipeline?

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Old   January 29, 2015, 09:00
Default How to simulate the flow of the particles (like sand) inside a pipeline?
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hi,all
i want to simulation the flow of the particles(like sand) in pipeline,but i don`t konw how to do this use openfoam(I'm learning openfoam for three days ).
please give me some advice or example
thank you!
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Old   February 5, 2015, 10:23
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Hello libo,

There are various options I think to do this, perhaps I am not even mentioning all of them.

There is a Two Fluid Model in OpenFOAM (called twoPhaseEulerFoam) which has tutorial cases for a fluidized bed, which is quite close to the application you are asking for (gas-solid flow). You could use this to simulate solids flow, you just have to change the domain a little bit and your boundaries. The disadvantage of this solver is that the theory behind the solids flow and rheology (Kinetic Theory of Granular Flow) is not very easy to understand on a fundamental level.

Also there are lagrangian solvers like DPMFoam and MPPICFoam that simulate the solids phase as parcels. I guess this comes closer to 'real' gas-solid systems. I do not know a lot about these solvers though.

Finally, there is something called LIGGGHTS and CFDEM; LIGGGHTS is a Discrete Element Method package and CFDEM is the LIGGGHTS package coupled with OpenFOAM (which calculates the gas flow part). See the link:
http://www.cfdem.com/about-cfdemrproject

Hope this helps a little bit. First make sure you have some experience with the most basic tutorials such as damBreak and cavity.

Kind regards,
Ramon
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Old   February 5, 2015, 21:04
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Dear Ramon,
Thanks for your reply.I`m so sorry,I did not descripbe my problem very clearly.I don`t want to simulate gas-solid flow.I want to simulate liquid-solid flow(some solid particle flow in the oil pipeline).I have been use the fluent-edem but my teacher wants me find other software to sovle this problem.
I have been read a literature ,the lagrangian solvers don`t consider the force to particle-particle,we need program the code by ourselves(the author use the Discrete Element Method).I think is too difficult for me.Is there some model about drag force,Magnus force,Saffman force in OpenFOAM?
Thank you so much!
LiBo
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Old   February 6, 2015, 03:49
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I think solid-liquid flow should as well be possible with CFDEM, see this link:

http://web.student.chalmers.se/group...SlidesOFW5.pdf

Also the forces you have mentioned should be in the model (I have not checked this myself though).

I am not sure whether these forces are also in an OpenFOAM model, I know there is no particle rotation force in twoPhaseEulerFoam for example, but I am not sure about the other two models I have mentioned. You can always look into the source codes of the solvers I have mentioned in the applications/solvers/ folder, then you can see which forces have been taken into account.

Programming your own DEM or DPM code is quite time consuming, it is even difficult to do this properly within a full PhD project (I have some experience with this...). Keep in mind that when modeling oil-solid flow that most flow solvers do not take the non-Newtonian behavior of the oil into account. Either you will have to edit the flow solver and mess around with the stress tensors, or you have to use a non-Newtonian solver and implement the fluid-particle interactions (which sounds like more work to me).

Kind regards,
Ramon
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Old   February 6, 2015, 06:03
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Thanks you again.
LiBo
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Old   February 8, 2017, 00:13
Default Solid Flow
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I want to simulate the solid flow inside the Iron blast Furnace . I have to take care of only solid nothing else . so is there any Solver there for solid flow simulation . Please help me .
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Old   May 23, 2017, 03:14
Default Error with DPM
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Hi. I have a problem. I used DPM solver for my project .First i changed the blockMesh without changing the kinematic cloud pisition file ,then changing the kinematic cloud pisition file without changing the blockmesh. For both of them the error is "Cannot find parcel injection cell".Please help me.
Both of work were attached.
Attached Files
File Type: gz Goldschmidt blockmesh.tar.gz (72.7 KB, 27 views)
File Type: gz Goldschmidt position.tar.gz (181.5 KB, 22 views)
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Old   November 1, 2017, 08:51
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May be too late for you m_snjri but I'll anwer that:

In the blockMesh-file you have the convertToMeters option before defining the vertices. This could make the dimension of your whole Mesh too small.
A second one, which is more likely, is your negative values in the kinematicCloudPosition file. Your blockMesh is not defined for those (60x10x50).
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Old   April 18, 2018, 17:52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by libo View Post
Dear Ramon,
Thanks for your reply.I`m so sorry,I did not descripbe my problem very clearly.I don`t want to simulate gas-solid flow.I want to simulate liquid-solid flow(some solid particle flow in the oil pipeline).I have been use the fluent-edem but my teacher wants me find other software to sovle this problem.
I have been read a literature ,the lagrangian solvers don`t consider the force to particle-particle,we need program the code by ourselves(the author use the Discrete Element Method).I think is too difficult for me.Is there some model about drag force,Magnus force,Saffman force in OpenFOAM?
Thank you so much!
LiBo


Hello LiBo,

How is going of your simulations? Which software are you using right now?

This is Min, I am at the beginning to use MPPICFoam/DPMFoam to simulate proppant transport in wellbores, which is very similar to your project. So I am wondering whether you could give me some suggestions.

Thanks and best regards,
Min
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Old   July 3, 2018, 02:13
Default fluent edem add-in
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hi dears,

I want to couple fluent and edem and for that purpose I need an add-in which by installing it and make new tab named edem in ansys workbench let me couple these software
dose anyone help me with these add-in because I can't download it from main website.

best regard.
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Old   July 17, 2018, 02:45
Default water flow over a sand bed
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Hi everyone
i want to simulation the flow over particles(like sand) in rive.Please suggest me which solver i should use in openFoam for that.
Thanks and regards
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Old   July 17, 2018, 03:19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A H Gazi View Post
Hi everyone
i want to simulation the flow over particles(like sand) in rive.Please suggest me which solver i should use in openFoam for that.
Thanks and regards
Hey there,
do you mean "over particles" as in "over one or more fixed particles that a not moving"? Then simply use OpenFoam in conjunction with a hydrodynamic transient solver (piso, pimple). Create the numerical domain using blockMesh and an .stl file representing your shape in snappyHexMesh.


If "over particles" means "flow with moving particles at the bottom", than go ahead and use CFDEM and Liggghts. Still requires OpenFOAM to simulate the fluid properties, but CFDEM/Liggghts will take care of the particle movement and the particle interactions.
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Old   July 17, 2018, 05:46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertHB View Post
Hey there,
do you mean "over particles" as in "over one or more fixed particles that a not moving"? Then simply use OpenFoam in conjunction with a hydrodynamic transient solver (piso, pimple). Create the numerical domain using blockMesh and an .stl file representing your shape in snappyHexMesh.


If "over particles" means "flow with moving particles at the bottom", than go ahead and use CFDEM and Liggghts. Still requires OpenFOAM to simulate the fluid properties, but CFDEM/Liggghts will take care of the particle movement and the particle interactions.

Thanks Robert for your quick reply...sorry for not giving details of my problem.Actually i have made the geometry in blockMeshDict.it is a scouring problem.like flow past a cylinder case.so for scouring i need sediment bed and that will be flow with moving particles at the bottom i think....will twoPhaseEulerFoam can do this?Thanks and regards
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Old   July 17, 2018, 05:58
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A colleague of mine uses OpenFOAM and CFDEM/Liggghts to simulate the movement of grains over sand ripples. So i think the software should be applicable to your scour simulation. I face i would go with the coupled approach in contrast to using a multiphase solver.
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Old   July 17, 2018, 09:29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertHB View Post
A colleague of mine uses OpenFOAM and CFDEM/Liggghts to simulate the movement of grains over sand ripples. So i think the software should be applicable to your scour simulation. I face i would go with the coupled approach in contrast to using a multiphase solver.
Thanks again Robert.I will try with this .
Regards
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Old   December 13, 2018, 17:48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by libo View Post
hi,all
i want to simulation the flow of the particles(like sand) in pipeline,but i don`t konw how to do this use openfoam(I'm learning openfoam for three days ).
please give me some advice or example
thank you!
I have a same problem . I want to simulate the particle cloud of sediment in water by openfoam.

I did not know how i shoudl do it.
please give me some advice
thanks
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Old   December 14, 2018, 04:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tooran View Post
I have a same problem . I want to simulate the particle cloud of sediment in water by openfoam.

I did not know how i shoudl do it.
please give me some advice
thanks
Did you even read the thread? Why does the posted advice not help you? Have a look at How to give enough info to get help.
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Old   January 2, 2019, 14:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RjwV View Post
I think solid-liquid flow should as well be possible with CFDEM, see this link:

http://web.student.chalmers.se/group...SlidesOFW5.pdf

Also the forces you have mentioned should be in the model (I have not checked this myself though).

I am not sure whether these forces are also in an OpenFOAM model, I know there is no particle rotation force in twoPhaseEulerFoam for example, but I am not sure about the other two models I have mentioned. You can always look into the source codes of the solvers I have mentioned in the applications/solvers/ folder, then you can see which forces have been taken into account.

Programming your own DEM or DPM code is quite time consuming, it is even difficult to do this properly within a full PhD project (I have some experience with this...). Keep in mind that when modeling oil-solid flow that most flow solvers do not take the non-Newtonian behavior of the oil into account. Either you will have to edit the flow solver and mess around with the stress tensors, or you have to use a non-Newtonian solver and implement the fluid-particle interactions (which sounds like more work to me).

Kind regards,
Ramon

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertHB View Post
Did you even read the thread? Why does the posted advice not help you? Have a look at How to give enough info to get help.
I am new in Openfoam, and I am trying to simulate sand particle in water. I started from hopper tutorial in openfoam. I wrote ./Allrun in terminal window. And after the completion of the simulation, I wrote paraFoam in terminal window but it shows some error, I can not veiw the result in openfoam. I dont know what is the problem that I can not see the results.

Thanks
Can you help me please?

Last edited by wyldckat; January 27, 2019 at 15:31. Reason: merged posts a minute apart
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Old   January 7, 2019, 03:52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tooran View Post
I started from hopper tutorial in openfoam. I wrote ./Allrun in terminal window. And after the completion of the simulation, I wrote paraFoam in terminal window but it shows some error, I can not veiw the result in openfoam.
Sounds like, the simulation is working and the problem is your paraview. If you post the error wich appears when typing "parafoam" somebody may be able to help you. But not without knowing what exactly is wrong.
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Old   March 4, 2019, 07:32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertHB View Post
Sounds like, the simulation is working and the problem is your paraview. If you post the error wich appears when typing "parafoam" somebody may be able to help you. But not without knowing what exactly is wrong.
Hello Robert

Is it possible to simulate the turbulent flow of gas and solids inside a pipe with openfoam?
Since it's turbulent flow, the cell size near to wall should be very small and it's less than particle size. How openfoam deal with it when calculating void fraction in each cell? in other words, can a cell size be smaller than particle size in openfoam?
I would really appreciate if you could help me with this problem.
Thanks
Esi
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