[medaouarwalid]

hello every one, this is a nozzle called ''lobed nozzle'', it has a circular shape at the inlet and a corrugated shape at the exit, in my case, the area of the inlet is 314 mm² . the area of the exit is 213 mm² .
experimentally, the velocity at the center of the inlet area was 7.5 m/s and when i mesured the velocity at the center of the exit it was 4.5 !!!
numérically it was an other thing , when i set inlet velocity at 7.5 it gave me 10 m/s at the exit which i think is a logical result if we consider the continuity equation. now i don't know what to believe because i repeated the experimental many times and i get the same result each time. There is something wrong here but i didnt find it
noting that i used the ''SST K-omega'' model and i set the the walls of the nozzle as '' no slip WALL'' in BC

[Blanco]

What about the density? Are you injecting a gas?

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by Blanco

What about the density? Are you injecting a gas?

Hot Air from hair dryer connected to the nozzle inlet

[Blanco]

Ok, so density can change between inlet section and outlet section, and all we know is that mflux=dens*A*vel=const. Therefore it is possible that experimental velocity is correct (!). Talking about your simulation: have you double checked the gas properties you're using in the model? Are you using ideal gas or what? Are the wall boundaries adiabatic, fixed T, etc.? What is the distance between inlet and outlet of the nozzle?

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by Blanco

Ok, so density can change between inlet section and outlet section, and all we know is that mflux=dens*A*vel=const. Therefore it is possible that experimental velocity is correct (!). Talking about your simulation: have you double checked the gas properties you're using in the model? Are you using ideal gas or what? Are the wall boundaries adiabatic, fixed T, etc.? What is the distance between inlet and outlet of the nozzle?

I didnt check gas properties, i am assuming that the fluid is incompressible because the velocity is not that high to concidere change in density , also for the walls i used the default setting , the distance between inlet and outlet is 90 mm

[Blanco]

Originally Posted by medaouarwalid

I didnt check gas properties, i am assuming that the fluid is incompressible because the velocity is not that high to concidere change in density , also for the walls i used the default setting , the distance between inlet and outlet is 90 mm

Ok, so now you have a list of things to check at least.

I don't know which program you're using, so I suppose that your "default" settings for wall are consistent with adiabatic walls.

Another question: is the nozzle "representative" of a small hair dryer in your intentions? If yes, then the "inlet" section is filled with cold air while hot air flows through the outlet section, or I am missing something?

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by Blanco

Ok, so now you have a list of things to check at least.

I don't know which program you're using, so I suppose that your "default" settings for wall are consistent with adiabatic walls.

Another question: is the nozzle "representative" of a small hair dryer in your intentions? If yes, then the "inlet" section is filled with cold air while hot air flows through the outlet section, or I am missing something?

First, the program i am using is ansys fluent and i cheked only option ''no slip" in wall BC.
second i am studying the effect of the geometrie of that nozzle on the augmentation of mixing the blowing air with the ambiant air, so the hair dryer is tool to give me hot hair , the outlet of the blow dryer is equal to the inlet of the nozzle. Also, i want to say that i mesure the inlet velocity afther that i joined the nozzle inlet to the blow dryer exit .

[medaouarwalid]

I went back to the lab and i did other mesurements. This time i mesured the central velocity not only in the inlet and outlet of the nozzle but also in different points of the centerline of the nozzle , here the new results:
- the velocity was 7.5 m/s only in the point of the grid of the exit of the blower ( see image 3 blower +nozzle ) ,
- when i go down a little bit from there , the velocity decreases until 3.15 and stay like this in the cylindre shape of the nozzle until it reaches the corrugated shape of the nozzle
- then it begins to increase until it reaches 4.6 m/s at the exit of the nozzle !!! Any explications please

[Blanco]

Now it makes sense to me:

1- the velocity you measured at the center of the nozzle inlet section is not representative of average inlet flow, because it is influenced by the grid and other stuff you have in the blower near its outlet section. I really think the velocity distribution is all but uniform in the nozzle inlet section.

2- going down along the centerline of the nozzle, the disuniformities you have tends to fade out and a more uniform flow is achieved, therefore the 3.15 m/s you mesured on the centerline "could" be considered representative of the mean flow though a nozzle section

3- the velocity you measured on the outlet section of the nozzle is 4.6 m/s in the centerline, I suppose. Here again I don't expect a very uniform velocity distribution on the outlet section, because of the particular geometry, but the continuity equation tells us that we're very close to theory:

3.15 * 314 / 213 = 4.64 m/s

and you have measured 4.6 m/s... It makes sense.

Btw: how are you measuring the local velocity? You have also to consider the influence you have on the flowfield.

[FMDenaro]

The setting of the numerical parameters at the inlet is very important... doing RANS you should prescribe a statistically averaged velocity profile. Consider also the requirement of the turbulence model varaibles at the inlet.
What is the geometry before of the inlet of the nozzle?

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by FMDenaro

The setting of the numerical parameters at the inlet is very important... doing RANS you should prescribe a statistically averaged velocity profile. Consider also the requirement of the turbulence model varaibles at the inlet.
What is the geometry before of the inlet of the nozzle?

The géométrie before the inlet of the nozzle is in the figure number 1 of the photo in the comments. A conical géométrie with a grid at exit

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by Blanco

Now it makes sense to me:

1- the velocity you measured at the center of the nozzle inlet section is not representative of average inlet flow, because it is influenced by the grid and other stuff you have in the blower near its outlet section. I really think the velocity distribution is all but uniform in the nozzle inlet section.

2- going down along the centerline of the nozzle, the disuniformities you have tends to fade out and a more uniform flow is achieved, therefore the 3.15 m/s you mesured on the centerline "could" be considered representative of the mean flow though a nozzle section

3- the velocity you measured on the outlet section of the nozzle is 4.6 m/s in the centerline, I suppose. Here again I don't expect a very uniform velocity distribution on the outlet section, because of the particular geometry, but the continuity equation tells us that we're very close to theory:

3.15 * 314 / 213 = 4.64 m/s

and you have measured 4.6 m/s... It makes sense.

Btw: how are you measuring the local velocity? You have also to consider the influence you have on the flowfield.

Ok, so i will take the velocity inlet as 3.15 m/s, also To mesure velocity i am using The TSI VELOCICALC® Multi-Function Ventilation Meter 9565-
Thank you for helping me ,m. Cordially

[FMDenaro]

Originally Posted by medaouarwalid

The géométrie before the inlet of the nozzle is in the figure number 1 of the photo in the comments. A conical géométrie with a grid at exit

Well, maybe you could do a try in adding this cone in the simulation.. I don't know how the grid can influence the inflow in the nozzle, in general a grid is used to make the flow more homogeneous...
If you use the incompressible formulation you can prescribe either the velocity or the pressure, what measurement about the pressure do you have?

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by FMDenaro

Well, maybe you could do a try in adding this cone in the simulation.. I don't know how the grid can influence the inflow in the nozzle, in general a grid is used to make the flow more homogeneous...
If you use the incompressible formulation you can prescribe either the velocity or the pressure, what measurement about the pressure do you have?

I didnt mesure the pressure because i am doing a dynamic study and i am interessting just in velocity, should i do mesurements of the pressure also ?

[FMDenaro]

Originally Posted by medaouarwalid

I didnt mesure the pressure because i am doing a dynamic study and i am interessting just in velocity, should i do mesurements of the pressure also ?

The key is that if you use RANS, you should measure a statistically averaged profile at the inlet (at least a sufficient number of points)... Are you able to do such a measure on the plane at the inlet?

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by FMDenaro

The key is that if you use RANS, you should measure a statistically averaged profile at the inlet (at least a sufficient number of points)... Are you able to do such a measure on the plane at the inlet?

Well the mesurements tool (
The TSI VELOCICALC® Multi-Function Ventilation Meter 9565-) has a probe wich dont allow me to do much mesurements at that plane ( i think you mean the grid) , maybe at the center and near to the nozzle walls thats all

[FMDenaro]

Originally Posted by medaouarwalid

Well the mesurements tool (
The TSI VELOCICALC® Multi-Function Ventilation Meter 9565-) has a probe wich dont allow me to do much mesurements at that plane ( i think you mean the grid) , maybe at the center and near to the nozzle walls thats all

would be more simple to do the measure in the cone plane before the nozzle??

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by FMDenaro

would be more simple to do the measure in the cone plane before the nozzle??

the cone is a small blow dryer i cant take off the grid of the exit

[FMDenaro]

Originally Posted by medaouarwalid

the cone is a small blow dryer i cant take off the grid of the exit

you can try to add the full cone in the simulation and prescribe a turbulent profile at the inlet of the cone...

[medaouarwalid]

Originally Posted by FMDenaro

you can try to add the full cone in the simulation and prescribe a turbulent profile at the inlet of the cone...

I dident understand what do you mean by prescribe a turbulent profile at the inlet of the cone , can you please explain more.